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Monday, 8 March 2010

My ancestors - the Warenne line

Having discovered that Margaret Puleston was my 'gateway ancestor', I carried on researching the numerous marriages along her ancestors' lineages. In my last post I described the discoveries of Margaret's Welsh connections. The research in all her Welsh forbears is incomplete because there are more lines to investigate. This post will concentrate on 2 lines that are generated from my Puleston line.

The son of the murdered
Sir Roger de Pyvelisdon, sheriff of Anglesey, was Richard de Pyvelisdon, who was appointed successor to his father by Edward I. According to Robert Sewell's site, Richard had married an Angharad, a daughter of a Warren from Warren Hall, Salop. This 'Warren' has been cited as being either William or Griffith de Warren, and the existence of both Richard and his wife are quoted in Burke's Peerage. Many websites and public family trees state that Angharad was a daughter of William de Warenne, the son of John de Warenne, the 7th Earl of Surrey, which cannot be true. William only had 2 children, John and Alice (John being the future 8th earl and last of the line) and born several months after his father's death at a tournament in 1285. So where was the connection? It's also not certain if Angharad was her name. It could have been Agnes or Ankaret, and this last name I have seen frequently in my researches. It sounds like a variation of Angharad, so I would be more inclined to believe her name was Ankaret. However, the important thing is that she came from a Warren Hall, which there is now no trace. It took a couple of days of painstaking going through hundreds of PDF pages of books I downloaded from the internet, but I finally found a reference for a Warren Hall. It came from a book published in 1782, which is available for download on the Ancestry website, written by the Rev. John Watson, called "Memoirs of the Ancient Earls of Warren and Surrey and their Descendants to the present time". I quote from this book;

"Earl William (the 6th earl) had also a natural son, called Griffin de Warren...From what mother this Griffin came, is uncertain; but that he was the son of this earl, appears from Vincent's Cheshire in the Herald's office, where is a pedigree of him, and his descendants, with the arms of the families they matched with. He married Isabel sister of Robert de Pulford...By the said Isabel the said Griffin had John de Warren, who married Audela, the daughter and heiress of Griffin de Albo Monasterio (we now call Whitchurch, Shropshire ). This John was Lord of Ichtefeld, in right of his wife, whose father obtained it, by marrying Audela...In one of the Harleian Mss. No.2131, it is said, that in the county of Salop, two miles from Ichtefeld, was an ancient castle, situated on a terrible morass, by a river side, which in times past was inhabited by the earls of Warren and Surrey, and was called earl Warren's castle. Near the same, situated on a little hill, was an ancient house called Warren's Hall."

So, it appears that there was an off-shoot from the main Warren lineage which started with the illegitimate son of William de Warenne, the 6th Earl of Surrey and Warren, namely Griffin de Warenne. The Earls of Surrey had lands practically in all the counties in England, and Shropshire was one of them. This, of course, means that I have a direct line from the 6th earl back to the first one who was given the title from William the Conqueror. In the book there is a family tree which has Griffin de Warren at the top and a further 13 generations below him. The Warren that fits into my family is the grandson, also Griffin, who married Winifred daughter of William of Broxton. I have been unable to find anything substantial about William Broxton, only that he owned land. Broxton is near Chester, about 11 miles away to the south of that city and checking on Wikipedia there is a Broxton Hall, owned by the Egerton family in the 17th century. The Egertons derived their name from the de Malpas family, specifically David de Maplas or le Clerk as he was known. A daughter of David married another Puleston descendant of mine which will be explored later.
This Griffin was born around 1240, and Angharad is said to be born about 1264, so he is the likley candidate to be her father. Let's now look at the information I have found on the lineage from the 6th Earl of Surrey.

William de Warenne, 6th earl of Surrey was born in 1166. He was known as William Plantagenet because he was the son of Hamelin Plantagenet and Isabella de Warenne. Hamelin became the 5th Earl by marrying Isabella who was the daughter and heir of the 3rd Earl, also called William de Warenne. Incidently, Isabella's first husband was William of Blois, King Stephen of England's son. Most of the earls were called William so it gets confusing at times. Hamelin also took on the Warenne name so was called Hamelin de Warenne! Hamelin's father was Geoffrey Plantagenet, Duke of Anjou, and an unknown woman, but is suspected to be Adelaide of Angers. Geoffrey is more known for being the father of King Henry II, through marrying his mother Matilda the daughter of King Henry I. Geoffrey's father was Fulk V of Anjou, who, after the death of his first wife, went to Jerusalem and became its king by marrying Melisende, daughter of Baldwin II of Jerusalem. According to Wikipedia, Geoffrey's lineage goes back throught he other Dukes of Anjou, including Geoffrey I known as Greymantle, but I'd like to check whether Wiki has got it right.

Going back to the Warenne's, the 3rd earl married Adela, or Ela, as she was known, whose ancestry include
Robert of Belleme, the 3rd Earl of Shrewsbury and his wife Agnes of Ponthieu. The 2nd Earl of Surrey, also you've guessed it, William, died in 1138 and was married to Elizabeth de Vermandois, daughter to Hugh Magnus, duke of Vermandois, who was the son of Henri I of France. Sometimes Elizabeth is known as Isobel in some books, but there is no doubt that she is the same woman who married William. Now I regard Elizabeth as another gateway ancester because looking into her ancestry opens up a treasure chest of connections with various royal houses in Europe. For instance her paternal grandmother was Anne of Kiev, daughter of Yaroslav I (nicknamed The Wise) of Kiev, himself a son of Vladamir I (known as Volodymyr the Great). The story goes that Henri could not find a suitable wife from the eligible pool of royal daughters because of consanquinity issues (they were too close as kin to him). So the safest bet for him was to marry Anne. Her mother was Ingergerd, daughter of King Olof of Sweden. Wiki goes further but I'll stop there. I think Wiki has got it right with these connections because they were such well known personalities.

Going back to Henri I of France, his father was
Robert II of France, son of Hugh Capet and Adelaide of Aquitaine. Henri mother was Constance of Arles and her lieage goes back to Charlemagne, founding father of both the French and German royal houses. I'm pretty sure that given these links to various monarchs in Europe, there are other lines leading to Charlemagne, but I need to double check my research to make sure that the lines are in order. Hugh Capet's paternal grandmother, Beatrice of Vermandois also has a line to Charlemagne (her great grandfather was Bernard of Italy, a grandson of Charlemagne.

The 1st Earl of Warenne, William, married Gundred, a daughter of
Matilda of Flanders. Matilda is best known as the wife of William the Conqueror, but it appears that she was married first to a Flemish gentleman named Gerbod. In some sources Gundred has been cited as the Conqueror's natural daughter, but it is likely that she was his step-daughter. There is no doubt that William was close to the Conqueror because he was given land near the battle of Hastings. Lewes Priory in Sussex was founded by the first Earl of Warenne. Also, de Warenne was associated with the family of Gerbod and inherited lands from that family. Matilda's father was Bladwin V, Count of Flanders and Adele, daughter of Robert II of France and Constance of Arles. Here we have another link to Charlemagne on Constance's ancestry. Also, Baldwin V's paternal grandmother was Rozala of Lombardy, who is also cited to be a descendant of Chalemagne! Is everyone related to Charlemagne? Seems so. Millions around the world are of course. Baldwin's gggg grandfather was Alfred the Great of Wessex or England, through Alfred's daughter Aelfthryth. Wiki has his line going back to the early 6th century, to Cerdic, King of Wessex. Again, I don't know how authentic Wikipedia's information is but this linege but must be easily available somewhere, and therefore well known. The information can actually be found in the Anglo-Saxon Chronicle, which ws translated by the Rev. James Ingram and published in 1823.

There are other links stemming from my Puleston ancestry to investigate, and one in particular is of interest. Remember the
Roger de Pyvelisdon from my last post who was hung by the Welsh for daring to collect taxes for Edward I's war with France? His wife was Agnes, daughter of David de Malpas, known as le clerc because he was an administrator for the earl of Chester, probably Ranulf, who inherited the earldom from his father Hugh Cyfeiliog. David's wife was Margaret daughter of Ralph ap Einion, whose wife is also said be related to the 4th earl of Chester Ranulph de Gernon. There were 2 David de Malpas so more research needs to be done to make sure that I have the right line. According to my research David's mother was Beatrix, an illegitimate daughter of Hugh, Earl of Chester. On the Peerage.com web site her name is unknown, but in Collins' Peerage Vol.5 her name is stated as Beatrix. Her husband, and father of David de Malpas, was William le Belward. William inherited the baronetcy of Malpas from his mother Lettice, daughter and heir of Robert, Baron of Malpas. So David was a grandson of Hugh, earl of Chester. I've read that Beatrix was illegitimate, but nevertheless a real catch anyway because illegitamacy wasn't so bad in them days. Hugh's father was Ranulf de Gernon, 4th earl of Chester, and his mother was Maud of Gloucester. Maud's father was Robert 1st Earl of Gloucester, one of many illegitamate sons of King Henry I, reputedly with Nest, daughter of Rhys ap Tewdwr, another direct ancestor (see last post). More research is needed on my possible connections to Hugh. earl of Chester, to confirm yet another wonderful lineage, though the link from Agnes to her father David le Clerk to William le Belward and Beatrix to Hugh seems pretty solid.

That's it for now. More next week.

29 comments:

Anonymous said...

Hello Gwyn,
Found your note about Lewis Owen, b1500. It appears that I may also be descended from him, down through Ann Edwards, b. 1750, and then she married Henry Knight. Just wondering: I have a print out of a document called Appenix 11, Ancestors of Ann Edwards, mother of George Knight, and it appears that she is descended from six hundred years of Welch Dynasty, starting with Idwallo, crowned in 688, and including Rhodri the Great, etc. I believe these documents come from Surrey, but am wondering what you think about this?
My name is Michelle Bowen, live in California. cmbowen@comcast.net

Gwyn Hughes said...

Hi Michelle,
Thanks for the comment.
The research I'm in the middle of would certainly be of interest to you because Lewis was married to Margaret Puleston. Her ancestry, according to my research, does go back to Rhodri Mawr and possibly to even earlier kings of early Britain, though solid proof is hard to come by. His ancestry, I believe, does go back to certain rulers of Wales, though I have not gone into it in detail, but I plan to.
It's interesting that the document you mention came from Surrey, seeing that we do have a connection with the Earls of Surrey (de Warenne)through Margaret.
I would love to know more about this document and who produced it.
I'm on the verge of completing my next post, another marriage off the Puleston line.
Look forward to hearing from you again.

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